Posted on Wednesday, 10/07/2009 - 8:53 a.m. PDT — by stoney4
When you take a week off from work, you notice things that you normally miss when you've normally left for the morning commute. This morning at about 8:15, heading east on Lone Tree Way, well before the crosswalk, a mob of kids were just taking their sweet time crossing the road from the Water Park to DVHS. I'm assuming the Tri Delta bus had just unloaded at the stop on the north side of Lone Tree. Maybe it would be a good idea if the co-principles would hop in their golf cart and visit this area once in a while and encourage these students to obey the law, wait for the light and use the crosswalk. Not only is this dangerous and annoying to drivers, it's one more example of kids ignoring laws and rules, knowing that they can get away with it.
Joined: Oct 2007
Current Posts: 687
I am surprised that you have not noticed but there appears to be a sector of society that thinks laws do not apply to them. It is perfectly acceptable to walk in the street instead of on a sidewalk, or cross any street where ever and when ever they please. Oh and they can take all the time they need to cross too, because anything you have going is nowhere near as important as what they are doing. Come on get with the program.
Joined: Jul 2006
Current Posts: 3156
Oh, I notice it all the time. And that's the problem, it's getting worse and worse because everyone says to just get used to it. That's the reason it's gotten worse. Whether it's slow jaywalking, littering, foul language on cell phones in public, head-thumping car stereo music that you can "feel" from a quarter mile away, etc, etc. There are no consequences for these so they will continue. Manners and respect for others apparently isn't taught at home anymore and society apparently doesn't have the resources to enforce "minor" infractions that most people don't seem to care that much about anyway. It's a sad comment on our society and not very encouraging for the future.
Joined: Oct 2007
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You will get no argument from me on this. It is high on my raise my BP list, thankfully I don't have to go too many places. If you think Lone Tree is bad try driving on East Cypress in Oakley especially the newer part between Sellers and Main St.
Joined: Mar 2008
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You are right Stoney. My father told us 5 years ago at 92 he worried for us and the way society was turning for the worse. I'm sure he isn't looking down on us laughing because it isn't a laughing matter.
Joined: Nov 2006
Current Posts: 1457
P5Ret, I've observed that same sector of society who believe that the laws don't apply to them; particularly the jay-walking!
They almost dare you to do anything. Those are the times I'd like to be a plain clothes cop! 
Joined: Dec 2005
Current Posts: 1247
@arne,
since i car pool/ drive my kid to school, i have seen many such occasions, but also seen cops observing, but not do anything about it.
i don't know why always things has to happens first, before action is taken.
I will keep my GUNS, my FREEDOM, my MONEY, you can keep the CHANGE
Joined: Jan 2008
Current Posts: 515
while traffic is being held up at a green light. Start moving forward and they hit the hood of your car or worse.. It,s so bad some will stop midstream and talk on a cell phone. Bicyclists to think they have more rights than registered drivers who pay taxes via car registrations each year....zipping thru red lights and intersections without stopping causing numerous near misses..
THE DENIGRATION OF SOCIETY, liberalism in CA has made it much worse along with public schools that teach kids that they have more rights and are entitled to whatever they want when they want it !!!!
Joined: Mar 2008
Current Posts: 439
It is all over town. "A" St, Gentrytown Dr, Putnam, Contra Loma ,Lone Tree from end to end.
Just GO. Doesn't matter if there is a light, cross walk or nothing. Just walk. Between cars on Lone Tree at Deer Valley High School. There is an attitude pervasive in this town and it is lack of parenting, manners, rules don't apply to me whatever you want to call it. I have never in my long life seen anything like it.
Joined: Dec 2008
Current Posts: 225
It's not just in Antioch, every city that has high schools or middle schools have the same problem with the students jaywalking or better said slow walking. Try driving on Concord Blvd. from 2:45 to 4:00 o'clock. Three schools all out at the same time all across the street from each other and the county bus stop right there.. You can't go to the shopping center less than a block away. Between the students wondering all over and the parents using the parking lot as a pick up area. The kids stand in between the gas pumps and ride their skate boards all over the sidewalks and pump areas. As bad as the H.S. kids are the middle school kids are the worst.
Joined: Jul 2006
Current Posts: 3156
A few years back I started a thread lamenting the disappearance of school busses. Remember school busses? A nice orderly line of them dropping off students in a designated drop-off zone. No long lines of short-tempered parents breathing exhaust fumes from the car in front of them dropping off or picking up their lids, causing traffic jams wherever there's a school. Another fine casualty of Prop 13. I don't know about anyone else but I'd be willing to pay a few more bucks in taxes if I knew they were going soley to purchase school busses. I wonder how many others who either do the dropping off and picking up or just hate getting caught in the jams feel the same way. But there were some who said they wouldn't let their kids ride the busses since the drivers wouldn't be able to control the bullying that would go on. What can you do?
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Stoney, Prop 13 had nothing to do with loss of school buses.
Poor management of school districts did.
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Maybe a crossing guard is needed? Somebody no one would mess with.
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Current Posts: 660
you are tight stoney iam off work due to injury and i took my grandson to day care i was on lonetree and decided to take DV rd. back to the down town area and was at the hwy 4 overpass and the hwy was jammed so i continued to try and get to 18 st. by going straight it was backed up to sunset so i turn west on sunset and that was backed up to past ace hardware,these side streets need time frames on when u can turn and drive on them its not fair to people from those local areas to have to wait for the people that dont want to get on the hwy pittsburg has plenty of them one near calif blvd between railroad and harbor and at belle dr. area and near winco ant mikes auto body,then u have all the btwd and oakley traffic avoiding 10th and flooding 6th st.and 2nd down town. well thats the peeve that i have luckily i didnt have to go as far as DV and experience the J walking kids but i have seen it in the past. if i would of been on my harley i wouldnt of had such a problem manuvering around the side streeters.
Joined: Oct 2008
Current Posts: 21
Its not just that they don't care, I think it is something far more harmful. Apathy. They just really and truly don't care, about you, about me, about themselves. I drive to drop my daughter off everyday at DVHS and I used to get soooo ticked off at these unruly "children". I thought how disrespectful, they are doing it on purpose to make people mad. But I really looked at them. They don't even see you, they are in their own little bubbles of apathy and entitlement. They are what's wrong with our society today.
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Current Posts: 4931
001, I saw a crossing guard jaywalking! A couple weeks ago (not in Antioch). Granted he wasn't walking across the 4 lane road oblivious to oncoming traffic and he wasn't working as a crossing guard at the time. I knew he was a crossing guard because he had his red handheld stop sign tucked under his arm. He stopped in the median to wait for cars on the other side, so I looked back to see if his sign had an orange "Slow" on the other side to make sure he wasn't a street repair traffic control contractor. It didn't.
But shoot, I have to admit sometimes I jayway downtown across 2nd street like from Ricks on Second to the El Campanil. It's probably no better than what that crossing guard was doing, but like him, I'm not being rude and disrespectful of others by making cars which have the right to drive in their lanes stop for you. It's really about being courteous and respectful of others that seems to be diminishing more and more these days in our society. I agree, not just in Antioch and it frys my kettle chips too.
Joined: Oct 2007
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Ok I'm going to easy your guilt a little. What you are doing downtown on 2nd street is not jaywalking. As defined in the vehicle code jaywalking is crossing the street out side of a crosswalk between to intersections that have offical traffic control devices (stop sign or signal), so unless there is a new stop sign on 2nd at I (I haven't been downtown in awhile, and don't remember one there) you are ok, as far as the jaywalking thing goes.
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Current Posts: 29
This morning on the way to BART I almost hit 3 kids crossing IN THE MIDDLE OF THE STREET on Leland, there was no light or lamp post and all 3 were wearing dark clothes so I couldn't see them!! They were half way across the street when I saw them, looked at my truck and kept walking!! They did not even pause to see if I was going to slow down!!! Just stepped right out in front of my truck!!! I was soooo irritated!!! Their mother's should have taught them to use a crosswalk and look both ways before crossing a street!!!
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Thanks RetP5 for easing my guilt about Jaywalking across 2nd street. It's hard enough to look both ways for traffic while you're also looking over your shoulder to see if there's a cop around.
Panther, that sounds scary. Glad you saw them in time.
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I'm glad too!!! Even though it would have been their fault I would have gotten sued!!!! Then I wouldn't have the money to come to Bases Loaded and eat delicious bread pudding!!! It is THE BEST!!! (besides my mother in-laws!!)
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Did it stay on the menu BJ? Please!!!
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Luke711, I saw the new menu last night. Randy told me they planned on rolling it out Monday. On the rough draft I brought home, I still see the Bread Pudding on it. It will be different though, as will a lot of things, as Patrick puts his signature on it. The description of the bread pudding on the copy I have says: "Thick, Warm, Drizzled with Bourbon Creme Anglaise, and topped with Molasses Candied Pecans." The bullet points say it's soaked in a custard base with golden raisens and cinnamon. Baked and served with a bourbon and vanilla creme anglaise sauce and dusted with powdered sugar. There is a note to the servers that although the bourbon is minimal, for flavor only, if people are sensitive to it, they can serve it on the side, or not at all.
I'm sure everything Patrick does will be better, in both quality and taste appeal for most people, including regular customers who had favorite items. My wife and I split the pot roast last night and we thought it was great. It's gone though. The pot roast and chicken fettucini got WAY better when Patrick took over the old menu, but he didn't want those entrees on the new menu. I'm sure they will occasionally appear on the daily steak, fish, or pasta item rotation, so they won't be gone for good. The mash potatoes that were a nightmare before, because of being "over engineered," as Patrick put it, will still be on the menu with his new recipe. Had them with the pot roast last night, and they were great.
My favorite side, the cream corn is gone. I ordered it every time, but the former chef would ruin it sometimes by putting too much white pepper in it making it too spicy. Patrick got it right and it was so good last night, but then I looked at the new menu and he took it off. He replaced it with potato salad. I'm going to miss it. We'll be down there Sunday celebrating a few family bithdays, but I'm planning on secretly celebrating the creamed corn's last harrah. Maybe the staff will surprise me, by dumping a pot of it on my head, like they do to the Superbowl winning coach with the gatorade?
We had to simplify the menu. It was too ambitious for starting out, and in hindsight, it was a mistake to try to open with it. The combination of having a new experienced chef and a more manageable menu, will put us on the right track. I only wish we had figured it out sooner, but we opened less than 2 months ago, so I think people will give us another chance since we are not a chain and needed some time to find the right formula. We chose downtown Antioch to launch our flagship restaurant in. Just think, Antioch is SO big, if we open a second one, we will already have it all figured out from the get-go!
Joined: Mar 2008
Current Posts: 439
I'm sure everyone here will enjoy your new posting. Marty and I have eated there 7 times and are looking forward to the new menu.. Can't wait for Arnie to get home for it too!
BJ, you folks, with no experience, have come a long long way. Thinking of a second one is a bit premature but in 10 years you might get it right. LOL
Thanks for working so darn hard and being brave enough to make a 180 degree turn!!!!
Nancy
Joined: Sep 2009
Current Posts: 34
This is just a matter of jaywalking -
It seems to me that the "hoodlums" are doing this to show us that they are in charge and we better respect them. They just walk or ride there bikes in the middle of the street, cut across moving traffic and jaywalk at a VERY slow pace.
It's almost like they are saying I'm going to do whatever I want and you are going to have to wait for me to do it!
The interesting thing is they are probably are in charge... I don't see anything being done to stop them.
Joined: May 2007
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Contact the school directly and complain. Then call the police and complain. This needs to be done everytime anyone see these kids doing this. If the police get enough calls they will start sitting there and hoepfully give out tickets.
Joined: Jul 2006
Current Posts: 3156
I sent an e-mail to the co-principles the same day that I started this thread. I never got a reply. Because of my hours, now that I'm back at work, I have no way of verifying whether this is a daily problem or not. Maybe it was a fluke and I never should have started the thread, but if it's a regular occurrence, then the lack of a response is an indication of what I was so upset about in the first place, and that's that no one in a position of authority cares that much about these kinds of things.
Joined: Mar 2008
Current Posts: 439
Yes, Stoney, it is a daily pattern and not just before and after school. It is whenever there are a couple of people together.
Glad you are better and back to the grind again.
It might be good to email Dr. Gill at the district and see what you get in response from him. He isn't at all like Dr. Sims was.
Joined: Sep 2009
Current Posts: 13
read the book HARD CHOICES:the Promise of an Innercity Charter School. The book shows what a "true leader" he really is as a founder and CBO of School Futures Research Foundation in San Diego CA trying to run E. C. Reams Charter in Oakland CA in the yr 2000. And there are other failures also.
Joined: Jul 2006
Current Posts: 3156
It's pretty obvious that you have an ax to grind with Dr. Gill and you've been plugging this obscure book for some time now. Why not take it up with the school board if you're so convinced that he's not qualified? As far as I'm concerned I'll put more weight on the opinions of faculty members and administration who work with the man and seem to be fully supportive.
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Current Posts: 13
I think we may agree it doesn't matter what I as a lone parent would have to say to sway a board to starry-eyed to see anything other than what they want. I'm trying to get this info out to as many others as possible to get an informed group of parents to hold our board accountable for their decisions. Most people will say"let my record speak for itself". Mr Gill can't, in the last nine yrs he has been involved in starting, running, and failure of several charter schools. The last one had only fourteen teachers and he was asked to leave after only after only two years. So excuse me if I have an ax to grind, our school can't afford another board created fiasco. I will trust the FACTS before following the herd. Read the book!!
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And how do we know that the book contains "facts"? How do we know that the author and you, for that matter, don't have an agenda? Most of us don't have the time or the wherewithall to investigate the allegations that are apparently made in this book. We don't know how selective the author was in who he used as sources. One single book is very thin data to back up an argument that a person is not qualified for a job, and it's really not worthwhile to debate the point any further for the reasons I listed above.
Joined: May 2007
Current Posts: 208
How long have you lived here we need the best? If it have been more than 10 years you would know that there has been many fiasco's with the AUSD and we have weathered them all. We have come out with money in the bank and a pretty good Board of Directors.
The teachers spoke out that they were unhappy with their current leadership and low and behold a change was made. Yes she quit but that was because she was feeling the pressure that she wasnt doing a good job in their eyes. That is how is supposed to work. Teachers compalined before and nothing would happen. I feel that teachers are getting stronger and now feel like what they say matters. They didnt feel this way before. I think things are changing for the better. You have to remember change takes time. I am willing to support this change till I see it is not working. I didnt have a problem with Dr Sims but everyone else did. I respect that and am willing to see things move forward.
Joined: Oct 2007
Current Posts: 687
No one at the school will do anything, the school will tell everyone that they shouldn't do it but when it comes down to it that is all they will do.
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Current Posts: 208
I care and I used to see it every morning on my way to work. I of course didnt call. But will now. I have been watching for it this year because I was going to make sure I spoke to the Principles in person about this. I havent noticed it but I could be getting there at a different time. No bus has been dropping off when I go by.
Joined: Sep 2006
Current Posts: 1928
Put them on notice! That bus stop will be moved to a mile from the school and they can walk their little selves all the way. The bus stop can be moved if the city deems it a hazard.
Joined: Mar 2009
Current Posts: 25
Not sure if you are aware that when you send a message to anyone in the district you need to put parent or student in the subject line to insure that it doesn't get put in the spam folder. I have always had e-mails from the Principals answered very quickly.
I drive down Railroad Ave in Pittsburg about 7:20AM there are students Jaywalking and its right in front of the Municipal Court buillding with Police allover the place!
Joined: Dec 2005
Current Posts: 1247
i think some of you are way out of line, to blame the school for that kind of disrespect for basic rules within a community.
if somebody is responsible, then the kids and the parents. specially the parents.
I will keep my GUNS, my FREEDOM, my MONEY, you can keep the CHANGE
Joined: Sep 2009
Current Posts: 13
The schools must take some responsibility, these kids are supposed to be LEARNING and that doesn't just apply to the classes their supposed to attend. Our district doesn't seem to care about quality as the board choice for the new superintendant shows. Until a STRONG LEADER is elected to the board, things will not change and our schools will keep getting worse. We cannot count not count on the parent or parents of these "thugs" to do anything so it falls on the shoulders of the rest of us to raise expectations of ALL THAT ATTEND AUSD(school board, administrators and teachers included).
Joined: Dec 2008
Current Posts: 225
I sure would like to know what your complaint about Dr. Gill is other than a book you refer to. It seems the the Staff and Teachers seem to behind him and as of this point, I don't know or have heard of any problems that he has been involved in. The AUSD was in complete disaray when the last superintendant was running the district. This tread was about the Jaywalking problem in and around the schools, you make it sound like it was Dr. Gill that caused the problem, maybe they are reading the book you speak of while they are crossing the road, that must be it! I solved the problem, take that book away, problem solved!! we need the best, get a life.
Joined: May 2007
Current Posts: 208
That was funny too old for this. I think you hit the nail on the head. I support Dr. Gil. I am hearing nothing but praise from Board members and teachers. They feel this is a good fit. I am going to give him the benefit of the doubt till he proves otherwise.
Joined: Mar 2008
Current Posts: 439
Thanks tooldforthis and kidsfirst. Don't know what this persons problem is but i suggest he /she sit down with Dr. Gill as some of us have. A few private citizens with no children in Antioch schools sat down with Dr. Gill and discussed many things with him. We came out in support of Dr Gill and will remain so unless we have to do just what we did with Dr. Sims. That option is always open but I doubt it will have to be used.
Now back to jaywalking......email Dr. Gill with your concerns. The school can have discussions with all students in the school in form of an assembly. One or more of them will get killed in front of the school. The foundation has been set. Time to speak up to the school and district.
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Current Posts: 13
If you read the book you would also be questioning this mans ability to run a school. Is it that difficult to go to the library and check out this book, come on people, the herd mentality needs to end. Of course the staff and teachers seem to be behind him, he's not Sims and he's a great guy, I would expect as much. But that doesn't mean he can lead our district. Facts speak louder than assumptions and the book gives you facts about his abilities. Jaywalking students are a by product of the disarray in the schools and community and until someone takes control from the top, things are not going to change.
Joined: Dec 2008
Current Posts: 225
You keep talking about the "book" and facts but you never give the so called facts, and my understanding is that the district looked into the "book" and the "facts" and nothing came of it. You must know the author or you are the author in so much as you keep telling people to "read the book" . While you're at the libuary, we need the best, check out the book "Helter Skelter" By C. Manson, it had "facts" in it also. Or maybe 1984 by G. Orwell, they both seem to follow your thinking.
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Amen
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Current Posts: 23
When Dr. Simms came to Antioch everybody liked her and thought she was the best. In time people who worked in the schools started to see problems and then people who did not work for the schools started to see problems and then it was obvious she was a problem then she left. Dr. Gill is new so everybody thinks he is the best because he has a different style than Dr. Simms. That does not mean he is going to do what he says. Do people who work in the district see things that are not what they should be? That is the first thing to look for. Being a nice man does not make a person a good superintendent. Do his acts match his words and are they the best for Antioch? Time will judge if the board made the right decison with Dr. Gill. Pray they were right and if not pray they find out fast.
Joined: Sep 2006
Current Posts: 4931
Sounds fair enough Old Timer. I'll buy that, but people don't even want to give the person a chance. At least he's been an interim superintendent for a little while, so they should have had some kind of idea what to expect.
Joined: May 2007
Current Posts: 208
Just wanted to send an update on the above issue. I drive by DVHS everyday at 8:10ish on my way to work and today low and behold there were 2 principals on the sidewalks right where the kids have been jaywalking. Isadore on the South corner right in front of the crosswalk waiting for the students and Bergerhouse coming up behind a huge group of kids on the north side of the street getting ready to cross. I was proud to see these guys out taking a personal interest in what our students are doing. Its not like they don’t have a lot on their plate and a lot of extra time to do yard duty. Who ever complained it worked. The kids really respect these principals and hopefully these kids will start respecting the community more and not jaywalk anymore. If so call the school and complain. I left Bergerhouse a message to tell him what a great job they are doing.
Joined: Jul 2006
Current Posts: 3156
On Monday the 12th I sent an e-mail to Dr. Gill. He sent me a very gracious reply the following day and said he would contact the co-principles. Apparently he has. I also contacted someone I know on the APD and he said he would have some of his men cite jaywalkers if necessary. Sometimes the squeeky wheel does get the grease.
Joined: Jul 2006
Current Posts: 3156
I just noticed a new story on the Times website about an 11 year old girl that was killed by a hit and run driver in Oakland this morning. She was on her way to school and in the crosswalk.
I appreciate the effort by the co-principles. I know they have a lot of territory to cover on that campus.
I also appreciate Dr. Gill's interest and the APD for their time.
Thanks to all involved. Let's hope it lasts.
Joined: Mar 2008
Current Posts: 439
Thanks to Stoney and Kidsfirst, everyone who has been monitoring this situation!!!
Stoney, I was pretty sure Dr. Gill would be quick to respond! Thanks to Dr. Gill too!!!!
Joined: Oct 2007
Current Posts: 16
Whose idea was it to put Contra Costa County's largest high school on the busiest street in Antioch, which also serves as the main thoroughfare of SE Antioch? Not to mention the fact the street's also regularly used by emergency vehicles to get through that part of town, and that the school is near the corner of a very busy intersection. That's very poor planning on the city's part, or at least, shortsighted planning. I'm usually at work so I don't have to worry about it, but whenever I was at home (I live close to the school) and need to go out, I try to avoid that area at 3 PM on a weekday.
Joined: Jul 2006
Current Posts: 3156
It's not just Deer Valley. If you're driving, you don't want to be anywhere near any school before or after school. As a result of the elimination of school buses the traffic jams are a nightmare. Someone mentioned earlier that prop 13 had nothing to do with the loss of buses. All California schools started losing money after prop 13 passed and most schools can't afford buses, so I'm guessing that there's a cause and effect there. Think of all the extra fuel burned; all the extra tailpipe exhaust produced and all the added stress added to the lives of people who get caught in the traffic and all the parents who do the dropping off and picking up since we lost the buses. Unless you build schools out in the middle of nowhere, you can't avoid it.
Joined: Nov 2006
Current Posts: 1457
We have the same problems around AHS as well, and toss in Park Middle School as well.
Stoney, the schools have received more money under Prop 13 and 98 than they ever had before. Be glad to share the info with you anytime.
Joined: Jul 2006
Current Posts: 3156
The way I've always understood it was Prop 98 yes but Prop 13 no, but I'll talk to you privately about it the next time I see you. I don't want to take over this thread with that discussion now, even though I was the one that brought it up.
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Current Posts: 1457
Okay, stoney, but when you see the actual property tax figures under Prop 13 you won't be too happy with the folks in the Legislature
Joined: Sep 2008
Current Posts: 130
When you see something like the PROP 13 debacle truly unfold and come to light over 30 years later; you really start believing that just about everything about the government is false and that most people in government wouldn't know the truth if they tripped on it. It's really a matter of the percentages and the particular housing market that you live in. The base percentage for property tax in CA is 1% (let's leave out all the SPECIAL ADD-ONs for a moment). OK? So if the property tax percentage is set at 1% (due to Prop 13) and the housing market in CA remained static over the last 30 years, then the CA Legislature would be able to cry "poor mouth" because as inflation for goods and services rose the property tax rates didn't rise to meet the costs of running the government. There is just one problem with this thinking; THE HOUSING MARKET! The housing market (even with it's up and down years) overall WENT UP! And in some markets tripled to quadrupled, or more! What does that mean; well 1% of a hundred thousand is a $1,000, 1% of a million dollars in $10,000. With the demand for housing in CA; the prices and building of NEW HOUSING in CA is way up over most states in the country. Therefore? You guessed it, the CA Legislature got more money in property taxes than they ever could have dreamed of if they could have raised the percentage over 1%. Also, most local governments have tacked on (along with the state) special taxes for different services (mosquito abatement, lighting and landscaping etc...) falsely invoking the "PROP 13 poor mouth" excuse. The people of CA have BEEN HAD! As usual no government on any level; local, state, or federal has learned how to budget their money wisely, save for a rainy day (down economy or housing market), and not take on too much debt. If I ran my household budget the way the government runs their budget I would be out on the street. Oh wait, some people (along with the government) do MISMANAGE their money this way! But the government can just keep crying "POOR MOUTH," print more money devaluing the dollar, and raise taxes so that they have even more money to waste and mismanage. Lucky Government!
Joined: Nov 2006
Current Posts: 1457
Jonesca, it is so nice to read that someone actually understands how the state and local governments actually received far more money under Prop 13 which outpaced inflation and population growth!
And as you so rightly indicated - our state and many local governments spent it all without setting aside sufficient funds for 'rainy days' like we have now.
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Current Posts: 34
When did the schools stop having buses?
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Current Posts: 225
gtom,
I going to guess you are not from this area.
District owned the land for years. Also, was not a major street when the school was built. Lonetree basicly ended at the golf course and airport, Lonetree was moved in the late 1990's, very little was east of Lonetree until houses were being built south of hiway 4 on hillcrest south. Early 90's, buliding was just starting to move Antioch southward. It was all open farmland and no devolpment was going on until about 1993 or 1994. I think, and correct me if I'm wrong, the farest anyone had bulit was Wild Horse, then Pondersosa on Hillcrest. There was no shopping center or anything in that part of town. Most of it was built at the same time or after the High School.
Joined: Oct 2007
Current Posts: 16
Toold,
You're right. I didn't grow up here. But yes, I am well aware of the history of how and when Deer Valley was built (I used to volunteer and work there as well), and how there was nothing around it but farmland when it was first opened back in the mid 90's. While I didn't go to DV (moved here in 2000), I did go to a brand new high school with a similar situation. There was absolutely nothing around but farmland when it was first built. However, the planners anticipated growth in the area and realized sooner or later the area would be developed.
There were two things that they did when they built the school, though. The first was that they didn't put the school on a major street like Lone Tree Way. They put it on a side street a couple blocks away from the nearest major street, so a lot of the traffic leaving the school was on that side street waiting to leave rather than clogging up traffic on the major street. You also don't have all the kids hanging around the major street once school got out and tying up traffic even more. By the time they got to the major street they thinned out enough that they generally didn't cause any major problems. The second thing they did was expand the major street to six lanes before anything else was built. While it was still a little slow going through it when school got out, it also didn't take me 15-20 minutes just to drive past the school. And this was for a high school that's a little more than half the size of DV.
Ignorance is no excuse for planning it the way Antioch did. But something tells me that they did know the surrounding area was going to be developed. You just don't build a school that size thinking that nothing's going to be built around it, and thus maxing it out in capacity. They built that school in anticipation of the growing population and the need to accomodate for future development. How many high schools of that size do you know was built in the middle of nowhere, and then 15-20 years later was still in the middle of nowhere? Didn't think so.
Joined: Dec 2008
Current Posts: 225
gtom,
I'm not arguing with you, but I think, and don't know for sure, no one ever expected east county to ever grow to the size it did in such a short period of time. City, county or state had no idea. Best exsample is hiway 4, it still hasn't caught up and won't for at least 10 years. AS far as High schools or any schools that were built on main roads, none were ever built that way but just off the top of my head, I know of at least 30 or more that are on main roads now. Just few, Concord High,( along with a middle school and elementry school right across the street) Los Lomas,, Libery in Oakley, Pittsburg's elementry school on Loveridge, Turner Elementry, those are some with lots more I can't think of right now, just in this area.
Again, I think, that the explosion of affordable housing that was built in east county when the housing prices went up so high, no one ever thought the the population would triple in such a short time.
Even the residents around NorthGate high school complain about Jaywalking and traffic and you almost have to have a GPS to find that school.
No matter where you build a school, homes will be built close by and businesses and shopping centers will be built near by, and kids will hang out at the shopping centers and Jaywalk or drive to get there and the businesses will complain about kids hanging around. But guess what, they opened their business there because kids have money, and the parents will stop there after picking up there students and spend money and there business will make money It's been going on for 59 years that I know of for sure and most likely for alot longer, matter of fact my dad took me by the store that he "hung out" at in the City when he was a teenager.
Joined: Dec 2005
Current Posts: 1247
@toold..
well, i think that our city council has failed over all those years. they are the one's who approved every new development without thinking ahead, or thinking about streets, schools, recreation, crime, police, fire, lighting and so on. we're sitting now in the middle of the consequences. i call it a mess.
one would think they have learned something...but, no way, they have not learned a thing. they still approving new developments, big box retailers in the middle of the city (lone tree target) they built a community center, where they were told during the presentation, that it would generate a deficit. we have a community center.! they have no vision about recreation, no vision about down town, no vision about jobs, or how to get business into town, we have no voice at important highways/ bart/ water/ library decisions, and the list is long.
have you ever tried to enter the new bypass coming from the bridge or 18th street? there is no on ramp....!!!!
go to a council meeting. they just sit there, no public discussions, things which matter are handled behind closed doors.
I will keep my GUNS, my FREEDOM, my MONEY, you can keep the CHANGE
Joined: Mar 2007
Current Posts: 46
Let me get this straight.
You want the City to build chess tables out in the full sun and rain in downtown Antioch, in one of your post then you say the City has no idea what they are doing?
Sounds like you are bi polar or suffer from disambiguation (manic) to me.
Joined: Dec 2005
Current Posts: 1247
@joecitizen,
my buddy buddy, just read my org post. off course i suggested a steel/ sail shade system...lol
thanks for the diagnosis...you must be the board doctor?
unfortunately you did not get any of my postings in regards to that topic. it's not about "my" chess tables idea, it's about NOT to spend $ 1,5 mill per field.
but more important. what is you position that parents of antioch high and deer valley high ask to spend $ 1,5 mill each for a artificial turf ?
I will keep my GUNS, my FREEDOM, my MONEY, you can keep the CHANGE
Joined: Jul 2006
Current Posts: 3156
There's a separate thread about chess boards and there's a separate thread about turf fields. If you want to talk about those two subjects, please do it on those forums.
Joined: Nov 2007
Current Posts: 1107
Seems to me that being off "subject" is what I suggested to Mr. Bazooka and his traveling dog and pony show awhile back.
Joe's posse didn't agree with me. Got any words regarding that issue? Maybe we should consider new rules of engagement. :)
Joined: Nov 2007
Current Posts: 1107
Apparently, the esteemed Dr. Joecitizen and Dr. Chewy agree on your sad diagnosis ..... delusions of grandeur.
Would you consider storing or selling your computer? This would help in the recovery process as you need much more bed rest with lot's tranquilizers.
Between you and me - that's the trouble with Berliners, if they can't take over the world ...... they try to take over city hall.
Joined: Dec 2005
Current Posts: 1247
@chewy,
one more doctor...great. why don't you put your finger in my, you know where..cough..cough...do you feel anything? whats the prognosis?
I will keep my GUNS, my FREEDOM, my MONEY, you can keep the CHANGE
Joined: Nov 2007
Current Posts: 1107
Cough, cough. Just a friendly reminder der Berliner, you have to have one in order to have it check by a Doctor.
what's the prognosis? Unfortunately, your bothersome cough will continue for the near term, because your voice box is overworked. Sorry.
Joined: Dec 2005
Current Posts: 1247
your diagnose sounds like it's comming from a under educated, under paid, democratic, universal health care system doctor.....how can i trust you? cough.....cough...
we're off topic. everybody is getting angry at you...
I will keep my GUNS, my FREEDOM, my MONEY, you can keep the CHANGE
Joined: Nov 2007
Current Posts: 1107
Forget it Berlin. I moved on.
I attack pompous, conceited, demagogues on sight with mighty and righteous indignation .... so I probably see you down the road.
Joined: Jul 2006
Current Posts: 3156
Interjecting a bit of good natured humor into a thread, as BJ has done in the past, and completely changing the subject of a thread to one being covered by another forum that is still active are two different things. Sort of apples and oranges. As far as rules, I'd call bringing a forum down to the level of childish name calling is worse than either of those two examples. I hope you people are proud.
Joined: Nov 2007
Current Posts: 1107
No sir - I'm afraid they are they are oranges and oranges. Many times the subject of the post was of a serious nature - and Joe and entourage decided to have fun instead.
You are guilty of equivocating Mr. Stoney .... and it doesn't look good on you.
BTW, before you answer that, consider this: you feel my sarcastic humor is childish in your thread. But you consider Bazookas brand of humor in another persons thread as acceptable, and not at all distracting from the original theme?
They are both distractions, Stoney ..... just different in temperament.
Joined: Sep 2006
Current Posts: 660
man whats wrong witt CHEW!
Joined: Sep 2006
Current Posts: 660
chewy chewy chewy gnaw on this the man is twice ur age even if ur are right in ur own mind RESPECT UR FREAKIN ELDERS U FREAKIN IDIOT.
Joined: Nov 2007
Current Posts: 1107
"RESPECT UR FREAKIN ELDERS"
Don't care ..... elders have to earn it too. I find him mean, stubborn and arrogant as if he were 21 years old anyway. He has given me a few one liners in the past ... you know the kind , meant as a cheap shot - rather than an attempt at serious dialog. Kind of like what your doing.
I found his attack on the mayor by using the forum as a lever to embarrasses the man into sending him some documents .... the height of arrogance. Don't like the man's personae .... at least as he presents that personae of himself on this forum. So I thought I would tell him about it.
"U FREAKIN IDIOT."
Just below my post you will find find Berlins - asking for a ball sack examination. Maybe you could oblige the old boy since you think he requires special handling. And after all it doesn't take much skill other than a warm finger.
BTW numbnuts, if he were twice my age that would make him 130.
Joined: Sep 2006
Current Posts: 660
then that makes you just as childish as he if ur that old and attacking like you are yes berlin is set in his ways ans sees things his way but if ur as old as u say u are then act it you may be able to take some advice from SOBE, lol i should take back the part of freakin idiot that puts me on the same level my bad chewy im sure ur a good dood but u two ol coots should be able to atleast keep it at a debate level.
Joined: Nov 2007
Current Posts: 1107
"as old as u say u are then act it "
I'll tell you jhd - life is too short to act your age. I like Obama. Berlin doesn't. I think most of his criticism of the man are silly and trivial .... for that very reason.
I know good people who do not have health care because they can't afford it. For me, it's personal. So Berlin and I are bound to clash - in spite of our ages. He doesn't like me, and I certainly don't like him.
".... debate level. " You should watch more cable news ..... and congress for that matter ..... there is no "debate level" any more. My position and my words are getting harder and harder as I watch political bomb throwers like Berlin doing business as usual.
Joined: Dec 2008
Current Posts: 225
Correct me if I'm wrong, chewy, but wasn't your complaint about taking the tread off subject just as you have just done? You choose to chastize Stoney and Bazooka Joe yet you do the same thing. What's the old saying, what's good for the goose is good for the gander!
Joined: Sep 2006
Current Posts: 4931
Shucks, I made ONE post on this whole thread, a serious one at that, way back in the beginning when I said:
"Sounds fair enough Old Timer. I'll buy that, but people don't even want to give the person a chance. At least he's been an interim superintendent for a little while, so they should have had some kind of idea what to expect."
But somehow I managed to get mentioned 3 times while people are slinging mud at each other! It doesn't pay to be serious! I can understand Stoney being chastised for not controlling his thread letting it get out of control, but what did I do this time? Where's my dog?... where's my pony?
Joined: Jan 2008
Current Posts: 1304
The way this thread is going these might be the Dog & Pony you need.
Joined: Sep 2006
Current Posts: 3050
where's my pony?
I thought you had a Bronco?
Joined: Sep 2006
Current Posts: 4931
Yep, and an Explorer too. It has a bumper sticker that says, "I BRAKE FOR JAYWALKERS!"
Joined: Sep 2006
Current Posts: 660
fair enough chewy, i personaly do not agree with the reasons obama was elected however if he had the policies i have i would of voted for the man and i will not even go into my opinions that i have about the man and the people under him,so why dont you and berlin just not communicate you know the barbs that are being thrown arent going to accomplish anything,the left and the right are so far apart the way things are going these days there are only dark clouds ahead,u guys at ur age are set on beliefs and it is what it is. good luck.
Joined: Dec 2005
Current Posts: 1247
@chewy,
He doesn't like me
wow..buddy. we do not know each other at all, we just have different opinion, that's all. think about that for a moment.!!!
what happens to america..were we can have different opinions and views, and still are friends?
i guess, you and the rest of the democrats have not noticed how you run us in the ground, and push the issues that everybody who does not agree with you're screwed up politics, is a "hater, bigot" and so on.
just look what you guys have done to california, now you're doing it at federal level.
welcome to socialism. i guess, i have to start planning my immigration to germany....lol
edit:
here is the latest gallop results
The decline in Barack Obama's popularity since July has been the steepest of any president at the same stage of his first term for more than 50 years
sorry to all the others , we're really off topic.
I will keep my GUNS, my FREEDOM, my MONEY, you can keep the CHANGE
Joined: Sep 2009
Current Posts: 34
Berlin,
I agree it is crazy that you can't get on the bypass from that direction. From what I have heard that is planned for one of the later stages of the bypass. I think it should of been done in one of the earlier stages.
Joined: Oct 2007
Current Posts: 16
toold,
Absolutely, wherever you have schools, you would also have to expect some jaywalking and also expect the surrounding streets to be more or less parking lots when school gets out. And that is exactly why you DON'T put the county's largest high school on the city's busiest street, especially one that's used by emergency vehicles all the time. You can put it on another busy street that's not used as much, just don't put it on Lone Tree.
Yes, the examples of schools that you gave are on busy streets, but none of them are nearly as busy as Lone Tree Way. Concord Blvd. (Concord HS) is pretty much a two lane road from downtown up until right before the HS. Broadway and Main St. (Las Lomas) are not nearly as busy as Lone Tree (most travelling north and south in that area take 680). Most of Liberty HS is actually on a side street. The student parking lot is even blocks away from Brentwood Blvd., not to mention that the school was opened before they even had cars. And the elementary schools only have a fraction of the population that Deer Valley has, so the traffic situation is not as bad. The best example I can give myself is probably De La Salle and Carondelet HS on Treat, and those schools were built over 40 years ago, and I'm sure much has changed since then.
I agree with you that no one probably expected the population to grow that fast in East County. But I would bet that city planners and council members knew that eventually someday that it would, just not at the rate that it did. I think that they approved a lot of the development that they weren't prepared to handle, and should've slowed down or take a step back to look ahead 20 years down the road.