Ya know I really wish those darn appliances would stop jumping in front of bullets. Seriously take a deep breath line up the sights ( on the target you want to shoot ) then squeze the trigger, or buy a set of laser grips: crimsontrace.com, they are cheaper than a new fridge.
If you have a .22 cal pistol, you can buy birdshot loads from WalMart. Effective at short range, huge pattern at twenty feet, probably non-lethal. Scares the hell outa ground squirrels and not nearly as loud as a bullet round.
I read that story and I wondered if there wasn't a little more to it then the paper said.
Why have a gun you don't know how to use? How did the refrigerator get in the way?(aren't they usually in the kicthen)
Why would someone in a nicer area of oakley just start kicking down someone elses door?
If all is as appears, then this person needs to either take some classes, or get rid of the gun.
There's probably nothing more to it. Most people don't know how to use their own weapon, it's just a fact. You have to go to the range regularly to keep sharp, it's all about muscle memory. That, and the thrill mixed with the trepidation of having an intruder trying to break in and thinking "Oh boy oh boy I get to use my gun!" for the first time will often have someone missing rather than hitting their target. Practice practice practice and next time you'll get the bad guy!!!
BazookaJoe has been trying to figure out a way to unload that old refrigerator of his. Do you think that maybe he thought he could get away with dumping it on this guy's doorstep and it tipped over off the dolly and banged into the front door? That would explain why the guy thought someone was trying to break in and he ended up firing at the refrigerator.
You assume that it was the front door the intruder was trying to kick down, it could have been the back door by the kitchen, which could explain why the poor Refrigerator got it. He could have been running and shooting towards the back door. You never know. It does not seem to be anything wrong with this story. It doesn't matter what type of neighborhood you live in, if someone wants to break in they will. My parents had someone break into a neighbors house around noon. They live a very upscale gated community, the burglar did not care where they lived.
Also I personally think he should keep the gun, jut taek some lessons. I am sure the burglar won't be back there again and I am sure he will tell his burglar friends not to mess with that gut. LOL.
I could not agree more (as a former firearms instructor) that if you own it you had better know how to use it and use it right. The two biggest problems I see here are unless you have been placed into a high stress enviroment you will not know how you will react to that type of stimulus. Where locally can you take a real class that will teach you how to use a firearm for self defense? The only rifle / handgun range that I know of locally is United Sportsmen in Concord, I don't know if they have self defense type classes there. They will not let you shoot at any target other than a bullseye type target. In order to have an effective stress shooting course you need to simulate what will happen, and the possible enviroment you will be in. Practice is great but unless you train the way you will "fight" the practice will not be very effective.
We can all have a laugh at this persons misfortune, but this is actually a serious event, and I agree that there may be more to this story than we are aware of, most burglary will not "kick in" a door for the simple reason that it makes too much noise. This sounds more like a home invasion robbery attempt to me.
Several officers reccomended shotguns for homeowners a few years ago, just point and shoot. 12 gauge is very effective and will stop the biggest intruder invading a home even in the dark, this from several law enforcement agencies. An excellent option for women also, just point and shoot, no need to aim or practice. No need to reload, the first shot will stop any criminal. A 12 gauge shotgun is the best option for non-gun users needing an effective tool to protect their family. It will stop an intruder permanently... now matter how large or powerful the criminal.
NO NEED TO PRACTICE, your kidding right so go out buy a shotgun never shoot it, and then when you need it not know how it works. Seems like a good idea to me, but hell I only have 10 years of experience training cops with firearms, so what do I know. Boy I can just see the first time someone lets a 12 gauge 00buck round go, that recoil is not fun by any streach of the imagination. I would never suggest a shotgun for a woman with the idea of just point and shoot. Now don't get me wrong there are plenty of women who can handle a shotgun or any gun for that matter better than some professionals I know, but there are probably more that could not handle the recoil of an effective 12 gauge round, (assuming that your intention is to stop the attack in the first place). Not to mention that a shotgun with a legal 18 inch barrel is not what I would consider a good option for inside a house, for someone who is untrained and not familiar with how to "work" an interior defense situation.
Bottom line if you own a gun any type of gun have a plan, make sure everyone in the house knows your plan, if you don't know how to conduct a building search, or you don't have to go looking for a family member when things go bad, stay put make the bad guy come to you on your terms, everything in your home can be replaced except family members. You know your house the bad guy dosen't so don't go looking for trouble if it comes to you deal with it. Find a safe place to seek cover, call the police announce in a loud voice I HAVE A GUN I KNOW HOW TO USE IT, I HAVE CALLED THE POLICE. OH AND MAKE SURE YOU TELL THE DISPACTHER THAT YOU ARE ARMED, AND WILL PUT THE GUN DOWN WHEN THE CALVARY ARRIVES.
Be safe, be aware, plan for the worst situation, you can only win if you are ready.
Why stop to dial a number and wait 40 minutes for a black and white to arrive??if someone storms your home in the middle of the night breaking down a door etc. just point and shoot. Just the sound alone "as relayed by the two officers"will send most criminals flying back out the front door. Most want to protect their families in violent home invasions.
The two fellow officers that gave the shotgun advice would not agree with you, they advised more than a few residents to get shotguns in the city were violent home invasions were increasing and "response times were horrendous", even they admitted they might not get their in time. The advice I posted came out of the mouths of not one but 2 sworn officers. "You know better than that if your really in law enforcement". Shooting a gun is not rocket science. If your door is busted down in the middle of the night, the intruder is violent and dangerous who ever they may be, should we stop to make a phone call, or pause to ask the criminal what hes doing???? Come on..... get real. The local police may not arrive in time in many large cities, and yes even in suburbia it could take 20-30minutes on a busy night. Many know that reality here in California.
No need for practice with a shotgun, just point and shoot---you wont miss. Of course the new owner should practice a few times, but really no need to. Cleaning and oiling the gun periodically, if the gun is not used for years at a time is important. As for the recoil>>> it is not an issue even for a small framed woman when your family is under attack, or worse. In some parts of the country not only do country folk have shotguns under their beds, but city dwellers too...sawed off...LEGALLY OF COURSE...BY A GUNSMITH just as the officers reccomended. Shotguns are preferred by many novices , you do not need to be a skilled sharpshooter to hit intruder the "first time "with a 12gauge. Based on your response you seem like you have never shot a shotgun. Your probable are more c-o-m-f-o-r-t-a-b-l-e with a handgun or a rifle if in a swat team. That is very different than an every day>> Jack>>, protecting his home. A shotgun of any size is the best option for a homeowner, who does not practice at a range...........regularly
I stick by what the two seasoned officers reccomended. There is no way any shooter can miss with a 12gauge shotgun, you don't need to be a sharpshooter or practicing each month as part of a job requirement. Just point in the general area and shoot in cases of a home invasion by a violent intruder in the middle of the night. And of course, responsible gun owners keep guns unloaded and locked if small children live in the home.
For any gunowner it is>>>>> preferrable to practice>>>>>>>>>, but not necessary with a shotgun that is purchased for home protection.
Just to keep it straight it was 12:47 in the afternoon. Not the middle of the night. Lots of people are around, and in and out of a house during the day. I'm surprized no one in the court he lived in didn't come at least do a look see.
Are you just trying to show how foolish you are. First of all sawing off a shotgun barrel is not legal, the minimum length of a shotgun barrel is 18". Just point and shoot no matter what is behind your target, I guess you never thought of that part did you. As for your veteran officers, gee I guess the 15 years I spent working as a paid officer and 11 years as a reserve officer mean nothing, oh lets not forget that I was a firearms instructor for 10 years. Gee two officers say that a shotgun is ideal for home defense I can line up several experts including officers that will say exactly what I said. That a shotgun is not the ideal weapon to use if you are going to be searching your house (and you don't know how to do it) for an intruder. A shotgun is a good weapon for home defense, if you know how to use it, and are willing to pratice with it, you cannot just point and shoot. The reality of the situation is that you had better identify your target and what is behind your target, you are responsible for eveyone of those lead pellets that come out of the barrel of that shotgun. Can you be certain that everyone is going to hit the target you want them to hit, even at close range, I can't.
As for never firing a shotgun over a three day "Tactical shotgun instructors course" I fired close to 1000 rounds of 00buck and slugs, so yeah I guess I never fired a shotgun. Your right I do feel more comfortable with either a handgun a carbine or submachine gun since I know where everyone of my shots will end up. I can not say the same of a shotgun once the range increases beyond 5 - 10 yards, and a single .32 caliber pellet (which is approx. what 00buck is) can do quite a bit of harm to someone you don't mean to shoot. To just tell someone to point and shoot (and hope for the best) is irresponsibile at best. Why do I not recommend a shotgun it is one simple word liability, a shotgun is one of the most simple guns to work and be effective with, but it is also one of the hardest to control if you need to fire multiple shots (believe it or not being hit by a shotgun is not an instant death sentence, and you can miss your target will not be standing still) you have to control the recoil, and it is a problem for most people. So beleive what you will, but I probably have more experience with firearms then your veteran officers, and for a person to not practice and learn how to use a shotgun properly and just point and shoot is something that I would never recommend.
Oh and by the way it will take you more time to get to your shotgun find the key unlock it, and load it then you probaly have once someone is in your house.
BBrentwood wrote:
if someone storms your home in the middle of the night breaking down a door etc. just point and shoot.
Sounds like what we need, a 12gauge...Going to share this w/the hubby. We're also getting an American Bulldog. It's too bad it has come to this, but w/gang graffiti behind my fence (that still hasn't been removed), an increase in crime, an economy in trouble, AND summer approaching, we'd feel much safer in our home...
At least learn how to use it, properly, and get a light on the gun so you know what the heck your shooting at, in the dark. Unless you are absolutly prepared to deal with the consequences of killing someone (there is no shoot to wound when a shotgun is involved) stick with the dog.
Hey P5
Most definitely going to research and then research some more the issue of owning a firearm. Definitely nothing to be taken lightly and has been a topic of discussion in our home for a couple of years now. We have children, and I've mostly heard the negatives about owning a gun w/kids in the house. I'd say of our circle of friends and family, it's about 1/2 and 1/2 do/don't.
We are VERY excited about purchasing our American Bulldog. I'm in the process of researching that too. They are pricey, but we're thinking of using our stimulus check to buy it.
Thanks for the advice.
Stoney, when I called the recycling companies they told me they wouldn't pick up a refrigerator with a shot compressor. Maybe I should have clarified what I meant by it being shot? Mine just needed to be replaced, no lead extraction necessary.
PR5 wrote:
Bottom line if you own a gun any type of gun have a plan, make sure everyone in the house knows your plan, if you don't know how to conduct a building search, or you don't have to go looking for a family member when things go bad, stay put make the bad guy come to you on your terms, everything in your home can be replaced except family members. You know your house the bad guy dosen't so don't go looking for trouble if it comes to you deal with it. Find a safe place to seek cover, call the police announce in a loud voice I HAVE A GUN I KNOW HOW TO USE IT, I HAVE CALLED THE POLICE. OH AND MAKE SURE YOU TELL THE DISPACTHER THAT YOU ARE ARMED, AND WILL PUT THE GUN DOWN WHEN THE CALVARY ARRIVES
Will also take that into consideration. Thanks for sharing!
***I could not agree more (as a former firearms instructor) that if you own it you had better know how to use it and use it right.****
My husband was also a Firearms and Reserve Academy instructor (with COCOCty) til January.
He made sure I could fire the home weapons accurately; would take me out to the "farm" range in Clayton several times a year...I'm only five feet tall so I'm not tall enough to do much damage other than shoot'em.
I have no qualms about it either. If it's them or me, aint gonna be me!
He figured a shotgun would knock "me"down.
Does Martinez Adult ed still have their course for Citizen's??? My husband also assist taught that class years ago.
Posted on Wed, 03/26/2008 - 17:26 — by fixthismess
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 16
I agree with the last poster.. take some gun classes. It's too bad you couldn't have tossed the intruder a HOT one.
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 310
Ya know I really wish those darn appliances would stop jumping in front of bullets. Seriously take a deep breath line up the sights ( on the target you want to shoot ) then squeze the trigger, or buy a set of laser grips: crimsontrace.com, they are cheaper than a new fridge.
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 186
or get a shotgun !!! no aim really required...
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 553
If you have a .22 cal pistol, you can buy birdshot loads from WalMart. Effective at short range, huge pattern at twenty feet, probably non-lethal. Scares the hell outa ground squirrels and not nearly as loud as a bullet round.
Roy Gursky http://gurskyranch.com
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 194
I read that story and I wondered if there wasn't a little more to it then the paper said. Why have a gun you don't know how to use? How did the refrigerator get in the way?(aren't they usually in the kicthen) Why would someone in a nicer area of oakley just start kicking down someone elses door? If all is as appears, then this person needs to either take some classes, or get rid of the gun.
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 201
There's probably nothing more to it. Most people don't know how to use their own weapon, it's just a fact. You have to go to the range regularly to keep sharp, it's all about muscle memory. That, and the thrill mixed with the trepidation of having an intruder trying to break in and thinking "Oh boy oh boy I get to use my gun!" for the first time will often have someone missing rather than hitting their target. Practice practice practice and next time you'll get the bad guy!!!
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 1709
BazookaJoe has been trying to figure out a way to unload that old refrigerator of his. Do you think that maybe he thought he could get away with dumping it on this guy's doorstep and it tipped over off the dolly and banged into the front door? That would explain why the guy thought someone was trying to break in and he ended up firing at the refrigerator.
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 61
You assume that it was the front door the intruder was trying to kick down, it could have been the back door by the kitchen, which could explain why the poor Refrigerator got it. He could have been running and shooting towards the back door. You never know. It does not seem to be anything wrong with this story. It doesn't matter what type of neighborhood you live in, if someone wants to break in they will. My parents had someone break into a neighbors house around noon. They live a very upscale gated community, the burglar did not care where they lived. Also I personally think he should keep the gun, jut taek some lessons. I am sure the burglar won't be back there again and I am sure he will tell his burglar friends not to mess with that gut. LOL.
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 310
I could not agree more (as a former firearms instructor) that if you own it you had better know how to use it and use it right. The two biggest problems I see here are unless you have been placed into a high stress enviroment you will not know how you will react to that type of stimulus. Where locally can you take a real class that will teach you how to use a firearm for self defense? The only rifle / handgun range that I know of locally is United Sportsmen in Concord, I don't know if they have self defense type classes there. They will not let you shoot at any target other than a bullseye type target. In order to have an effective stress shooting course you need to simulate what will happen, and the possible enviroment you will be in. Practice is great but unless you train the way you will "fight" the practice will not be very effective.
We can all have a laugh at this persons misfortune, but this is actually a serious event, and I agree that there may be more to this story than we are aware of, most burglary will not "kick in" a door for the simple reason that it makes too much noise. This sounds more like a home invasion robbery attempt to me.
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 239
Several officers reccomended shotguns for homeowners a few years ago, just point and shoot. 12 gauge is very effective and will stop the biggest intruder invading a home even in the dark, this from several law enforcement agencies. An excellent option for women also, just point and shoot, no need to aim or practice. No need to reload, the first shot will stop any criminal. A 12 gauge shotgun is the best option for non-gun users needing an effective tool to protect their family. It will stop an intruder permanently... now matter how large or powerful the criminal.
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 310
NO NEED TO PRACTICE, your kidding right so go out buy a shotgun never shoot it, and then when you need it not know how it works. Seems like a good idea to me, but hell I only have 10 years of experience training cops with firearms, so what do I know. Boy I can just see the first time someone lets a 12 gauge 00buck round go, that recoil is not fun by any streach of the imagination. I would never suggest a shotgun for a woman with the idea of just point and shoot. Now don't get me wrong there are plenty of women who can handle a shotgun or any gun for that matter better than some professionals I know, but there are probably more that could not handle the recoil of an effective 12 gauge round, (assuming that your intention is to stop the attack in the first place). Not to mention that a shotgun with a legal 18 inch barrel is not what I would consider a good option for inside a house, for someone who is untrained and not familiar with how to "work" an interior defense situation. Bottom line if you own a gun any type of gun have a plan, make sure everyone in the house knows your plan, if you don't know how to conduct a building search, or you don't have to go looking for a family member when things go bad, stay put make the bad guy come to you on your terms, everything in your home can be replaced except family members. You know your house the bad guy dosen't so don't go looking for trouble if it comes to you deal with it. Find a safe place to seek cover, call the police announce in a loud voice I HAVE A GUN I KNOW HOW TO USE IT, I HAVE CALLED THE POLICE. OH AND MAKE SURE YOU TELL THE DISPACTHER THAT YOU ARE ARMED, AND WILL PUT THE GUN DOWN WHEN THE CALVARY ARRIVES. Be safe, be aware, plan for the worst situation, you can only win if you are ready.
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 239
Why stop to dial a number and wait 40 minutes for a black and white to arrive??if someone storms your home in the middle of the night breaking down a door etc. just point and shoot. Just the sound alone "as relayed by the two officers"will send most criminals flying back out the front door. Most want to protect their families in violent home invasions.
The two fellow officers that gave the shotgun advice would not agree with you, they advised more than a few residents to get shotguns in the city were violent home invasions were increasing and "response times were horrendous", even they admitted they might not get their in time. The advice I posted came out of the mouths of not one but 2 sworn officers. "You know better than that if your really in law enforcement". Shooting a gun is not rocket science. If your door is busted down in the middle of the night, the intruder is violent and dangerous who ever they may be, should we stop to make a phone call, or pause to ask the criminal what hes doing???? Come on..... get real. The local police may not arrive in time in many large cities, and yes even in suburbia it could take 20-30minutes on a busy night. Many know that reality here in California.
No need for practice with a shotgun, just point and shoot---you wont miss. Of course the new owner should practice a few times, but really no need to. Cleaning and oiling the gun periodically, if the gun is not used for years at a time is important. As for the recoil>>> it is not an issue even for a small framed woman when your family is under attack, or worse. In some parts of the country not only do country folk have shotguns under their beds, but city dwellers too...sawed off...LEGALLY OF COURSE...BY A GUNSMITH just as the officers reccomended. Shotguns are preferred by many novices , you do not need to be a skilled sharpshooter to hit intruder the "first time "with a 12gauge. Based on your response you seem like you have never shot a shotgun. Your probable are more c-o-m-f-o-r-t-a-b-l-e with a handgun or a rifle if in a swat team. That is very different than an every day>> Jack>>, protecting his home. A shotgun of any size is the best option for a homeowner, who does not practice at a range...........regularly
I stick by what the two seasoned officers reccomended. There is no way any shooter can miss with a 12gauge shotgun, you don't need to be a sharpshooter or practicing each month as part of a job requirement. Just point in the general area and shoot in cases of a home invasion by a violent intruder in the middle of the night. And of course, responsible gun owners keep guns unloaded and locked if small children live in the home.
For any gunowner it is>>>>> preferrable to practice>>>>>>>>>, but not necessary with a shotgun that is purchased for home protection.
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 194
Just to keep it straight it was 12:47 in the afternoon. Not the middle of the night. Lots of people are around, and in and out of a house during the day. I'm surprized no one in the court he lived in didn't come at least do a look see.
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 310
Are you just trying to show how foolish you are. First of all sawing off a shotgun barrel is not legal, the minimum length of a shotgun barrel is 18". Just point and shoot no matter what is behind your target, I guess you never thought of that part did you. As for your veteran officers, gee I guess the 15 years I spent working as a paid officer and 11 years as a reserve officer mean nothing, oh lets not forget that I was a firearms instructor for 10 years. Gee two officers say that a shotgun is ideal for home defense I can line up several experts including officers that will say exactly what I said. That a shotgun is not the ideal weapon to use if you are going to be searching your house (and you don't know how to do it) for an intruder. A shotgun is a good weapon for home defense, if you know how to use it, and are willing to pratice with it, you cannot just point and shoot. The reality of the situation is that you had better identify your target and what is behind your target, you are responsible for eveyone of those lead pellets that come out of the barrel of that shotgun. Can you be certain that everyone is going to hit the target you want them to hit, even at close range, I can't. As for never firing a shotgun over a three day "Tactical shotgun instructors course" I fired close to 1000 rounds of 00buck and slugs, so yeah I guess I never fired a shotgun. Your right I do feel more comfortable with either a handgun a carbine or submachine gun since I know where everyone of my shots will end up. I can not say the same of a shotgun once the range increases beyond 5 - 10 yards, and a single .32 caliber pellet (which is approx. what 00buck is) can do quite a bit of harm to someone you don't mean to shoot. To just tell someone to point and shoot (and hope for the best) is irresponsibile at best. Why do I not recommend a shotgun it is one simple word liability, a shotgun is one of the most simple guns to work and be effective with, but it is also one of the hardest to control if you need to fire multiple shots (believe it or not being hit by a shotgun is not an instant death sentence, and you can miss your target will not be standing still) you have to control the recoil, and it is a problem for most people. So beleive what you will, but I probably have more experience with firearms then your veteran officers, and for a person to not practice and learn how to use a shotgun properly and just point and shoot is something that I would never recommend. Oh and by the way it will take you more time to get to your shotgun find the key unlock it, and load it then you probaly have once someone is in your house.
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 127
BBrentwood wrote: if someone storms your home in the middle of the night breaking down a door etc. just point and shoot.
Sounds like what we need, a 12gauge...Going to share this w/the hubby. We're also getting an American Bulldog. It's too bad it has come to this, but w/gang graffiti behind my fence (that still hasn't been removed), an increase in crime, an economy in trouble, AND summer approaching, we'd feel much safer in our home...
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 310
At least learn how to use it, properly, and get a light on the gun so you know what the heck your shooting at, in the dark. Unless you are absolutly prepared to deal with the consequences of killing someone (there is no shoot to wound when a shotgun is involved) stick with the dog.
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 127
Hey P5 Most definitely going to research and then research some more the issue of owning a firearm. Definitely nothing to be taken lightly and has been a topic of discussion in our home for a couple of years now. We have children, and I've mostly heard the negatives about owning a gun w/kids in the house. I'd say of our circle of friends and family, it's about 1/2 and 1/2 do/don't.
We are VERY excited about purchasing our American Bulldog. I'm in the process of researching that too. They are pricey, but we're thinking of using our stimulus check to buy it. Thanks for the advice.
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 2441
Stoney, when I called the recycling companies they told me they wouldn't pick up a refrigerator with a shot compressor. Maybe I should have clarified what I meant by it being shot? Mine just needed to be replaced, no lead extraction necessary.
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 127
PR5 wrote: Bottom line if you own a gun any type of gun have a plan, make sure everyone in the house knows your plan, if you don't know how to conduct a building search, or you don't have to go looking for a family member when things go bad, stay put make the bad guy come to you on your terms, everything in your home can be replaced except family members. You know your house the bad guy dosen't so don't go looking for trouble if it comes to you deal with it. Find a safe place to seek cover, call the police announce in a loud voice I HAVE A GUN I KNOW HOW TO USE IT, I HAVE CALLED THE POLICE. OH AND MAKE SURE YOU TELL THE DISPACTHER THAT YOU ARE ARMED, AND WILL PUT THE GUN DOWN WHEN THE CALVARY ARRIVES
Will also take that into consideration. Thanks for sharing!
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 112
***I could not agree more (as a former firearms instructor) that if you own it you had better know how to use it and use it right.****
My husband was also a Firearms and Reserve Academy instructor (with COCOCty) til January. He made sure I could fire the home weapons accurately; would take me out to the "farm" range in Clayton several times a year...I'm only five feet tall so I'm not tall enough to do much damage other than shoot'em. I have no qualms about it either. If it's them or me, aint gonna be me!
He figured a shotgun would knock "me"down. Does Martinez Adult ed still have their course for Citizen's??? My husband also assist taught that class years ago.
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 93
My grandmother could have aimed better.
And she's paralyzed.
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 4
the intelligence in these responses is amazing..